---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: AvianResearchDivision <segerfan83@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: [R-sig-ME] Extremely High Slope/Intercept Correlation
To: "Viechtbauer Wolfgang (STAT)" <
wolfgang.viechtbauer@maastrichtuniversity.nl>


Male is not dichotomous, it has 59 levels for 59 different males.  I run
this same model, but with a different dependent variables and I get much
lower correlations.  Can someone please explain what "This can be caused by
having more complexity than the data allows. Note that the variance of the
random slope is small." means?

Thank you,
Jacob


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 4:35 AM, Viechtbauer Wolfgang (STAT) <
wolfgang.viechtbauer@maastrichtuniversity.nl> wrote:

> I assume 'Male' is dichotomous, so it has just two levels. Not likely that
> one can estimate any variance components based on that grouping variable
> with any degree of precision.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: r-sig-mixed-models-bounces@r-project.org [mailto:
> r-sig-mixed-models-
> > bounces@r-project.org] On Behalf Of ONKELINX, Thierry
> > Sent: Monday, December 02, 2013 10:20
> > To: AvianResearchDivision; r-sig-mixed-models@r-project.org
> > Subject: Re: [R-sig-ME] Extremely High Slope/Intercept Correlation
> >
> > This can be caused by having more complexity than the data allows. Note
> > that the variance of the random slope is small.
> >
> > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> > Van: r-sig-mixed-models-bounces@r-project.org [mailto:
> r-sig-mixed-models-
> > bounces@r-project.org] Namens AvianResearchDivision
> > Verzonden: maandag 2 december 2013 2:05
> > Aan: r-sig-mixed-models@r-project.org
> > Onderwerp: [R-sig-ME] Extremely High Slope/Intercept Correlation
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I came across extremely high slope/intercept correlation (-1.00) when
> > running the following model:
> >
> > model<-lmer(X~Y+(Y|Male))
> >
> > summary(model)
> >
> > Random effects:
> >
> >  Groups             Name               Variance          Std.Dev.
> > Corr
> >
> >
> >  Male                (Intercept)          1.562e-01        0.3952284
> >
> >                         Y                       7.581e-07       0.0008707
> > -1.00
> >
> >                         Residual            2.661e-01        0.5158953
> >
> > Number of obs: 879, groups: Male, 59
> >
> >
> > What is causing this?  This high of a correlation does not seem possible,
> > especially in ecology.  Any suggestions moving forward?
> >
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > Jacob
> >
> >         [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
> >
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